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1 Gus Kilthau
| gus ~AT~sampsonafb~DOT~com |
to Richard Fortin --
I apologize for not asking you if your service dates, the ones you specified you had, were ALL active duty time or if the period from February through September of 1961 was RESERVE time...
If so, then you were not earlier and not now eligible for membership in the American Legion.
Rules are rules. We all know that. If a person wants to be a policeman, there are rules. If a person wants to be a doctor there are rules. If a person wants to be a chicken or a turkey there are rules.
If your time was active duty time, then there are rules that make you eligible. If not, then not.
Whatever it may be, Richard, I and the rest of us wish you the best of good luck and good fortune. You are already a member of a great Vets organization - this one. so no matter what else is the case, if anything else is the case, you did the right thing and joined in here with your brothers and sisters.
I apologize to you and all for my sorry ignorance of simple arithmetic... Your dates of service, 1961 minus 1955 really do equal 6 years. I am a dumbhead for not seeing that!
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SAFBVA Member No. if any: 1410
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: Flt 905 & 3650th USAF Hospital
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): 51-56 (Should have learned to add and subtract back then) 9 /March /2010--21:07 - Houston, Texas
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2 Gus Kilthau
| gus~AT~sampsonafb~DOT~com |
For Richard Fortin -
Here is the reply I received from the HQ of the American Legion concerning the dates of eligibility for membership in the AL as your service dates fit them:
"Hi Gus,
I think you are right. In 1997, our dates of eligibility for the Vietnam War changed from December 1961 back about 10 months to February 28, 1961. He was once ineligible but now he is likely fully eligible, if he was on active federal service (in an active component) at any time after February 28, 1961.
Of course I’d need to see his DD Form 214. He can fax it to me (ATTN: Bill Sloan) at 317-630-1413, or of course he can take it to any local American Legion post and ask the adjutant or commander to take a look.
Thank you for your service, as well, and for helping this veteran.
Bill
William H. Sloan
Assistant Director
Internal Affairs and Membership
The American Legion"
Sloan is saying that your service dates fit the VietNam War period eligibility dates, and he says that prior to the change of those dates in 1997, your service dates did not fit the ones set by the U.S. Congress.
Good luck (now that it is 13 years later than 1997)
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SAFBVA Member No. if any: 1410
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: Flt 905 & 3650th USAF Hospital
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): 51-56 (Still growing back then) 9 /March /2010--11:46 - Houston, Texas
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3 bob Juhler
| txjuhlers2~AT~att~DOT~net |
Richard Fortin. Are you aware of two old time organizations that will allow you membership . One is the NCOA(non-com officers asoc.), the other is The AirForce Sargeants Assoc. I'm only guessing , but having served for 6 years,did you make E-5(Staff Sgt) Thats the minimum requirement to join the above organizations. I might add that anyone coming into the service after Viet-Nam and before Desert Storm, are in the same category that you are in. I joined the Af knowing that at any time we may have to go to war, and of course hoping we wouldn't. I could have got out in 1959, after 4 years, and would not have been eligible for membership in those org. I elected to stay for 21yrs.. My father was WW2 Navy and in later years was Post Commander of his local American Legion. They were very active in community affairs, as was I. Gus and Carl have done alot of research for you. Hopefully you will knock the chip off you shoulder, do your thing. Will we see you at the reunion in September? Lots of luck to you
SAFBVA Member No. if any: 3720
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: 4362/3665th sq
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): BMT June-Aug 55 8 /March /2010--20:24 - Arlington Texas
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4 Ed Bresnahan
| calif_bres_03~AT~comcast~DOT~net |
Hello Richard Fortin --
My suggestion would be to go directly to Henry J Sweeney Post #2 (American Legion) - 251 North Maple Street - right there in Manchester - Tel (603) 623-9145.
Heck, I'll bet someone there will get you enrolled in a matter of minutes -- also quite likely they will invite you to take part in the up-coming St Patrick's Day Parade.
Try it -- you'll like it
If you do, then the next time I'm in Manchester I will buy lunch. How's that for a deal you can hardly refuse.
SAFBVA Member No. if any: LM2752
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: Flt 397 & 3650 Pers Proc Sq
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): June 1951-June 1952 8 /March /2010--16:52 - Citrus Heights, CA (formerly Manchester NH)
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5 Gus Kilthau
| gus~AT~sampsonafb~DOT~com |
To Richard Fortin ...
Doggone it, the American Legion states that their membership eligibility rules require a bona fide U.S. military veteran to have served for ONLY ONE SINGLE DAY within the date brackets they list, one of which is your very own date bracket. You fit in with about 6 months in the VietNam War bracket.
Because you continue to ignore what the AL says about the deal, I have gone to the trouble of making inquiry of them about your eligibility.
After I had looked at the AL requirements for membership on their website and ALSO on the website of one of their local branches, it was totally apparent to me that your dates of service (and that of your father, too) make you qualified to join their group.
That left me with two impressions: (1) someone misled you by telling you that you were not qualified to join, and (2) either that or you simply do not want to join. If some clown told you wrong, you can easily overcome that misinformation. If you just do not want to join, why gripe about not being able to join when, clearly, you can do so?
Maybe your attitude toward them is sort of like mine was when I was contacted by the British Royal Society of Health asking me to join their outfit. I could have gotten in for 9 bucks (early 1950's 9 buck kind of money!), so they said. All I had to do was to send the money and I could qualify as a "Wet Fish Inspector" or one of their other categories. I did not have the 9 bucks at that time. Now I hate them because I know that I would have made a great "Wet Fish Inspector" or one of their other nifty deals. Back then my compadres used to tell me "JOIN UP or SHUT UP" whenever I put the badmouth on that Royal Society of Health. Something to think about !
Anyway, Richard, as soon as the AL puts their official word on me I will pass it along to you. In the meantime, good luck to you.
:-)
SAFBVA Member No. if any: 1410
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: Flt 905 & 3650th USAF Hospital
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): 51-56 and more (One war after another, right?) 8 /March /2010--15:14 - Houston, Texas
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6 Carl Wenberg
| zoombag~AT~comcast~DOT~net |
I was going to let this subject go, but Richard since you asked my rationale on why you were denied membership in AL & VFW I think it was summed up it is NOT the ORG. who sets the rules on membership it is the US CONGRESS enough said
SAFBVA Member No. if any: 935
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: flt 3029
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): jan/mar 1954 8 /March /2010--14:44 - Yarmouthport, Ma. (Cape Cod)
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7 Bill Ray
| ironknee2005~AT~gmail~DOT~com |
I, like Richard Fortrin, fall into that category. As a veteran of the cold war, 1955 to 1959 I did not fight an active war although there were those who did lose their lives in the preparing for war should it have broken out. Believe me when I say there were many close times like when an unidentfied aircraft was seen on radar by NORAD. Unlike Mr. Fortrin, I don't wish to belong to any of the groups other than this one, I have been invited but have had to explain to them that under their rules I was not eligible. I've no wish to belong to the Eagles, VFW, AL. In all honesty, I wouldn't fit in as I only have “Cold War” stories to tell, so why not tell them here?
I know I am a Veteran, I have my discharge hanging on my office wall, I have my original DD214 in a safe place protected from water or fire, I even have one of my old name tags that I had on my fatiques
showing the outfit I was in. So, I ask, what more do I need?
SAFBVA Member No. if any: 1279
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: 4576
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): Basic 8 /March /2010--14:28 - CFO
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8 Jim Daley
| jimfdaley~AT~comcast~DOT~net |
Hey, Richard...........................you're spending a lot of time bitching in the wrong kitchen.
Here are two toll-free numbers to call and get the straight poop from.
American Legion - Member Services - 800-433-3318
VFW - Help line - 800-VFW-1899
SAFBVA Member No. if any: 4176
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: 1776
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): 7-9/52 8 /March /2010--14:18 - Colchester VT
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9 Donald White
| oldshakey11~AT~aol~DOT~com |
To clerify afew things. The AL and VFW do not decide
who can be a member. Congress does. Amvets will accept any honorably discharged vet.
SAFBVA Member No. if any: 800 life
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: flt.3270
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): Apr.- June 54 8 /March /2010--14:13 - Ilion N.Y.
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10 Richard L. Fortin
| RLFortinNH~AT~aol~DOT~com |
Carl Wenberg,
If These groups are as influencial as you claim they are then why do they refuse membership to those of us who through no fault of our own did not serve in the years that they consider as eligible. The VA recognizes me as a Veteran and makes a lie of their contention that we are not full veterans. If they are so influential why then don't they change their own membership rules then they could claim to speak for ALL veterans not just those that they want to be selective about. These organizations are losing members not gaining the recent veterans are not flocking to membership in the AL VFW etc. Why dont they open it up to those of us who could help increase their so called influence, at present they do not speak for me and I don't wish to belong to a group that does not recognize me as an equal. So if they are as powerful as you say they are why are they excluding a group of veterans who served in non war years. How do you explain that. Isn't that a form of descrimination?
I am really only interested in honoring my father who was an early member of the AL unfortunately he to grew to find the AL irrelevant especially when he found out that they would not accept me, after that he never renewed his membership. I am not interested in just belonging so that I can bend an elbow at some bar reeking of cigarette smoke drinking boiler makers. Do you feel that we in the years that I served should be denied membership? If so what is your rationale for that.
SAFBVA Member No. if any: 4270
Flt No. or Duty Station, etc.: 4665, Sq 3657
Yrs at SAFB, (P/P or Other): Sep to Dec 1955 8 /March /2010--13:50 - Manchester, NH
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